2015 Re-Readalong: Eye of the World and The Great Hunt

[Rhed al'Tere]

Re: 2015 Re-Readalong: TGH Chapters 10-16

Thank you all for continuing the discussion even though I've been absent!

I'm hoping to catch up this week, but with Anni coming this weekend, I'm not sure I'll be able to.

I am on chapter 5 of TGH, though, and I'll try to get my notes copied over before heading to Georgia on Thursday.

Happy reading, all!

 

[Imzadi Hopewind]

Re: 2015 Re-Readalong: TGH Chapters 10-16

enjoy Anni! We'll post here about what we read

 

[Maibella ni Rhoiden t'al'Varrak]

Re: 2015 Re-Readalong: TGH Chapters 10-16

I'm getting caught up as well but here are a few quotes that stood out to me:

"No one can rally around a woman who has to scrub floors and pots all day." Well, actually, they can, and they do.

"Let whosoever sounds me think not of glory but only of salvation." Aw, poor Olver ... he just wanted to be saved from the Trollocs.

"You really are going mad if you suspect Ingtar." Sadly not my friend.

 

[Iria Saronin]

Re: 2015 Re-Readalong: TGH Chapters 10-16

"No one can rally around a woman who has to scrub floors and pots all day." Well, actually, they can, and they do.

Oh my..! I missed this, thank you for pointing it out. So cool.

I'm also super excited reading Verin's scenes, she was always one of my favorites, and now her interests in dark topics seem to fit in the picture so well. I almost feel like I should have seen it coming before she even entered Egwenes room to drink tea...

-It's quite scary to think of the Horn of Valere being used for the Shadow. :eek

I noticed that this is the first time (I think?) that it was said that the Horn can be used against the Light, and it was said by Amyrlin, but not straight words. Actually, it sounded to me a bit of an Aes Sedai wording (at least in Finnish :arch). Something like "whoever can sound the horn, and the heroes are not bound to the Light but to the Horn". In my opinion, this only let's everyone think that heroes will be bound to the Dark, if a darkfriend sounds the horn. Was this intentional? A way to ensure that even if the Horn was never recovered, it would be sounded in the end? Maybe I'm just seeing too much manipulation everywhere, these books do it sometimes. :P

I was reading the New Spring for the first time last week (just finished it today, yay I liked it!), and I can say that it really was a good side-reading to the beginning of TGH.

 

[Toral Delvar]

Re: 2015 Re-Readalong: TGH Chapters 10-16

I'm getting caught up as well but here are a few quotes that stood out to me:

"No one can rally around a woman who has to scrub floors and pots all day." Well, actually, they can, and they do.

I'm not sure about that. They took advice from Siuan, very grudgingly, but it was clear most of them didn't want her there and she was never put forward as someone to rally around

 

[Maibella ni Rhoiden t'al'Varrak]

Re: 2015 Re-Readalong: TGH Chapters 10-16

I'm not sure about that. They took advice from Siuan, very grudgingly, but it was clear most of them didn't want her there and she was never put forward as someone to rally around

I was referring to later in the story when they rally around Egwene even though she's been reduced to a Novice and is scrubbing the pots and doing meaningless chores.

 

[Wil Cambrae]

Re: 2015 Re-Readalong: TGH Chapters 10-16

A few things that I noticed on this reread. They almost always refer to Suian as "The Amyrlin". Even Moiraine says Amylrlin in her head when she thinks of her. Is this just Tower training, Robert Jordan trying to subdue Siuan's personality until she gets Stilled or what?
Also during the Hunt, Uno sees a woman in white at two different houses along the way. Is this supposed to be Lanfear keeping an eye on Rand until she meets him in the Portal Stone world? Could Hurin's smelling of something worse than Fades and Trollocs be Landfear (if that is who it is) instead of the assumed Fain?

 

[Toral Delvar]

Re: 2015 Re-Readalong: TGH Chapters 10-16

I was referring to later in the story when they rally around Egwene even though she's been reduced to a Novice and is scrubbing the pots and doing meaningless chores.

I didn't think of that. I suppose there is a similarity, though she refused to acknowledge the demotion

 

[Imzadi Hopewind]

Re: 2015 Re-Readalong: TGH Chapters 10-16

Yes, I think it's Lanefar Uno see twice. Because it was a lady in white And I still think it's Fain Hurin is smelling, because he's a mix of different kind of evil...

 

[Corrine Erydinan]

Re: 2015 Re-Readalong: TGH Chapters 10-16

Since I'm a little behind, (chapter 24 EotW) I'll just start where I'm at and write about some of my impressions over the course of the re-read and some things I've read in this thread so far.

I was into the re-read, but I was completely sold on it when the party makes their way to Shadar Logoth. I got chills reading about the mist wandering around the city, how trollocs still hold it in their memory as a source of fear. When they went back in all they found were blood and scratches on the walls crying out to the DO to save them. They prayed - to the dark one, the truest evil that can be named in the wheel, to save them from the evil of the mist lurking in Shadar Logoth. And when they met Mordeth and figured out something was amiss because he held no shadow I actually shivered and fanned my flashlight across the room I was in (I like to read in bed and don't have a lamp).

Many folks have been expressing how young our favorite characters are in The Eye of the World, and its really astounding to me after having seen them all hardened so quickly. Its insane how much they have to change over the very short years, and its never more apparent to me than by going back again. I was sort of wondering, do we know how many years pass from the beggining of EotW to the end of MoL? *wanders off to the library*

Wanted to also thank those of you who pointed out the earliest form of Rand channeling when he urges Bela to run faster. I missed that the first and second time through but of course that's whats going on when he gets chills.

I smiled ear to ear when Bayle Domon showed up to save them on the Arinelle. I've read this so long ago that much of my memory of the first couple of books is restricted to major plot points, this is quite eye opening. I am also enjoying everyone's responses and discussion.

 

[Megana Vallentin]

Re: 2015 Re-Readalong: TGH Chapters 10-16

I'm not sure but I think it was only like 2 years from start to finish. I'm sure someone will come along who knows!

 

[Kassina Tendar]

Re: 2015 Re-Readalong: TGH Chapters 10-16

=CorrineI smiled ear to ear when Bayle Domon showed up to save them on the Arinelle. I've read this so long ago that much of my memory of the first couple of books is restricted to major plot points, this is quite eye opening. I am also enjoying everyone's responses and discussion.

Same! I suppose it wasn't that long ago, but I really only remember the major events. My main memories from the first half of TGH are just the boys walking with Uno. So it's like reading everything all over again! It's fun that I can still get excited over thing because I've forgotten all the smaller events.

 

[Megana Vallentin]

Re: 2015 Re-Readalong: TGH Chapters 10-16

I'm getting slower about posting my comments...I still read just as fast, just laaaazy about posting.

Chapter 10:

I'm surprised Perrin isn't hiding. Several times he says something odd and stares at Hurin very blatantly. It's like he really just wants people to know.

What was that scene in the house with Rand? Other than super creepy. A trick Lanfear played, something to do with ta'veren? Or something else?

Chapter 11:

Perrin and Mat FINALLY get it. And what does Mat do? Run away. This part of his personality makes me so mad. He's got a flippin' cursed dagger that can kill with a single scratch and is making HIM crazy, and he still treats Rand that way? And later on when he has all those memories, it doesn't get any better. Generally I love Mat, but this makes me so mad!

Chapter 12:

At this point in my first few read-throughs, I always thought Moiraine must be a Dreamer. That's why they say she should be there to train Egwene and that's why she was always asking the boys about their dreams. But then they also say there hasn't been a Dreamer in a long time, which was confusing to me at first.

Also, hearing that Moiraine, Liandrin and Verin all took off suspiciously made me feel like we (the readers) were missing a big part of the story by only following what Egwene and Nynaeve were doing. :tug

Chapter 13:

Egwene dreamed about Lanfear bending over Rand while he slept beneath the stone. Do you think Rand actually used the stone in his sleep or maybe Lanfear did it?

Chapter 14:

WINTER DAWN THE WOLF! :rofl That's awesome!

*cough* Anyway. I wonder if Verin knows about Ingtar, or vice versa?

Chapter 15:

What ARE those lines in the sky?

If this is an alternate world, who the heck is chasing Rand in his dreams now?

Chapter 16:

Ugh I hate Lanfear. I put off reading this chapter for a few days because I didn't want to read about her.

 

[Murun]

Re: 2015 Re-Readalong: TGH Chapters 10-16

I'm not sure but I think it was only like 2 years from start to finish. I'm sure someone will come along who knows!

You're right with that - let's say roughly two and a half years. Beltine / Winternight was late March 998, and that year ends with the end of TGH and the beginning of TDR - it's spring in the lowlands when Rand goes off to tear. The year 999 ends with the battle of Dumai Wells, and then things are moving rather quickly, no matter how many volumes they fill. The LB must take place middle of August to mid-September 1000.
There is a very good if incomplete (does not include ToM and AMoL) timeline site, but much must be left to conjecture.

 

[Ryu Shadowborn]

Re: 2015 Re-Readalong: TGH Chapters 10-16

Sorry I have been absent, lack of time to post things.

TEoTW 42

Spoiler

The Boys tell Moraine of their dreams, something Moraine really probably should have been told sooner, and she thinks she can try to Dreamwalk. I personally would have loved to see that..just for her meeting the Wise Ones.

We also see one of the major problems that the light has and the source of 99% of the problems in the series. Nobody trusts anyone, Of course that is by Ishamael's design what with him having 3 Thousand or so years to screw with people.

TeoTW 43 :

Spoiler

I want to know more details into the creation of the ways, they were apparently made through study of portal stones, and I guess only men(?) help to make it which means a Single Male Channeler made it, since they can't form circles without Women. I wonder who it was, and if he used Angreal and if so which one since it would seem to me that it would take a great deal of the One Power to do something like the ways.

Also if the Taint caused the ways to go dark, why did it take so long to do so? shouldn't signs have started showing up rather quickly?

TEotW 44 + 45

Spoiler

More ways, not much to comment on here

TEotW 46

Spoiler

I love the borderlands, the entire concept of a set of nations on the edge of hell, just human willpower and stubbornness holding back the ever present flood of evil. Also Algamar is awesome, a bunch of random farm-lads show up with Moraine and he actively treats them with respect. That right there is a true Lord to me, and we Meet Ingtar. Ingtar is probably my favorite character in the entire series..tied with Verin. However Verin has the advantage of lasting for more than 2 books, it made me sad that Neither showed up as Heroes of the Horn, but I will gripe about that later.

TEotW 47

Spoiler

We learn of Lan and Fain's backstories, and sorta Cements Lan as nearly the perfect Paladin to me, and we set up for something that takes till the end of the series to pay off, with the Golden Crane.

TEotW 48

Spoiler

Into the Blight, I honestly wish the Blight got a bit more screen time to it as the series went, all of these tainted creatures and all we see of them is this, nothing showing up in the last battle, no Trollocs on Defiled Bison or Mammoths..or anything like that. Also how small are the nations in Randland, they get across Malkier really darn fast for something that is supposed to be a nation unto itself.

TEotW 49

Spoiler

The blight awakens, and we meet the green man. The Green man knows of Wolfbrothers. I wonder if they existed in the Age of Legends, the way the Wolves talk it was even before our "present" time that wolfbrothers existed, but the Green Man can notice one by sight, I wonder of the green men were like the Ogier and came from some other world.

TEotW 50

Spoiler

Howdy Forsaken, you aren't at all important here so go have some french fries until you get revived and become important later on. The really important thing here is the Eye itself. Something created for the "Greatest Need that will be seen to that time, or perhaps ever" This as a phrase interests me because what we see the Eye used for is not really...the Greatest Need Ever. Neither uses that we see really. Setting a Low level forsaken on fire and protecting the horn of Valere are not particularly high need in the scheme of things, but I will speak of what I think the Eye was really for much much later

TEotW 51 - 53

Spoiler

Not much here, We find the Banner of the Dragon, the Horn and go back to Fal Darra, One thing I am really Curious of is. Rand and Co are in the real world when they get to the Eye of the world...Rand and Aginor face off, Rand nukes him then Travels to Tarwin's Gap..evens the odds and heads up to face Ishamael. At what point does he end up in the world of dreams to face off against Ishamael since the room and everything else that we see in the first few books regarding Rand and Ishamael facing off is generally implied to be in the world of dreams/Dreamshards?

TGH Prolouge

Spoiler

not much here really, we see darkfriends gathering, only thing of real note i have to ask is did the Seafolk Darkfriend ever make an appearance? I don't recall that ever being a thing later on.

TGH 1-3

Spoiler

A long area of not a whole lot to comment on, This whole expedition on Suian's part does seem odd, wouldn't it have made more sense to bring the boys to Tar Valon with an escort of Gaurds who are heading south with the horn anyways? I know 3 Tav'eren are a big deal but still, there could have been more sensible ways to go about this.

And I will end there for now, since my next post will probably be quite wordy and complicated.

 

[Murun]

Re: 2015 Re-Readalong: TGH Chapters 10-16

Chapter 10: I'm surprised Perrin isn't hiding. Several times he says something odd and stares at Hurin very blatantly. It's like he really just wants people to know.

No, he doesn't want them to know - he's just got that enhanced sense of smell (which will serve him well on many occasions to come), and he picks up traces Hurin doesn't get (and vice versa, he does not have Hurin's talent).

What was that scene in the house with Rand? Other than super creepy. A trick Lanfear played, something to do with ta'veren? Or something else?

No explanation provided, but a trap Lanfear set up seems a good enough interpretation - after all. she wants him to channel.

Also, hearing that Moiraine, Liandrin and Verin all took off suspiciously made me feel like we (the readers) were missing a big part of the story by only following what Egwene and Nynaeve were doing.

Yes and no: We will learn where Moiraine went (as much to get away from the sisters and their criticism of her, as in search for information), and Verin just can't leave Rand alone (her own will or orders?). Liandrin following "on Moiraine's heels" is the only hint we get that she may have a hand in the Draghkar attack later on.
Btw., Verin says "Moiraine sent me", and (at the end of the book) Moiraine says "No, I didn't". One of them must lie ... there were clever readers who picked up the hint at first reading. Sorry, I didn't.

Egwene dreamed about Lanfear bending over Rand while he slept beneath the stone. Do you think Rand actually used the stone in his sleep or maybe Lanfear did it?

I'm convinced Lanfear did it. Think of it as dating - and didn't it work rather well? Rand was deeply impressed, just that he didn't go for her talk about greatness. The words about the horn, "do not think of glory but only of salvation" mark a central divide in the series - the bad guys and girls think of glory and will have their comeuppance.
Ah, Lanfear ... we will see her do lots of bad things and some important good ones - and in the end, it's just her ambition, her hunger for power that breaks her neck, it only took Perrin to execute the judgment. Tragic? Somewhat.

Anyway. I wonder if Verin knows about Ingtar, or vice versa?

If (and it's an "if") Verin was at the DF meeting, she may have suspicions. Vice versa? No. How should he have recognized her?

 

[Murun]

Re: 2015 Re-Readalong: TGH Chapters 10-16

While I'm at it, some more reading notes:

Ch. 9: Who was the arrow for?
Dominic at the 13th Depository has developed quite a convincing argument that the arrow was meant for Siuan, not for Rand (read the article).
In short, he says that Baal'zamon had rather elaborate plans for Rand, and that he wanted him alive rather than dead - so why throw all this away? The death of Siuan, however, with Elaida as the most likely successor, would have served him very well.
My own more modest puzzlement: Why just one arrow? Why not try again?

Ch. 10:
- We get first details about the Aiel.

- Perrin is smelling "wrongness" with his wolf-enhanced nose.

- Ingtar's pessimistic outlook on the world. Says a lot about his motivation to become a darkfriend - in Ch. 46 he will return to this topic:

"Humankind is being swept away everywhere. Nations fail and vanish. Darkfriends are everywhere, and none of these southlanders seem to notice and care. We fight to hold the Borderlands, to keep them safe in their houses, and every year, despite all we can do, the Blight advances. And these southlanders think Trollocs are myths, and Myrddraal a gleeman's tale." He frowned and shook his head. "It seemed the only way. We would be destroyed for nothing, defending people who do not even know, or care. It seemed logical. Why should we be destroyed for the, when we could make our own peace? Better the Shadow, I thought, than useless oblivion, like Caralain, or Hardan, or ... It seemed logical, then."

This is why I called him a deeply troubled but not really evil man. Note also that he only talks about letting the Grey Man in, not about the Trolloc attack and freeing Fain. I prefer not to believe Jordan's interview statement.
We know that somewhere in the background of Jordan's story there is the antagonism "communism vs. 'free world'" - his war experience. So we have here a comment on appeasement politics - nice try, won't work. - Sorry, but Jordan was also just a man of his time, with no chance to know he was fighting for the DO all along.

Ch. 11: Mat & Perrin learn about Rand's ability to channel: Yes, Mat is a bit of an asshole; but he's needed for success ...
Perrin, once more levelheaded and accepting. Reminds me of something Lan told him after the rescue from the Whitecloaks: "There will not be much randomness in your life", and Perrin in a way seems to trust the Pattern.

Rand's problem with being subject to conspiracy: Did Moiraine give him the banner so as to make him stay or to make him run? Any move of his could be part of her plans ...

Ch. 12: Egwene had already channeled before meeting Moiraine? No. That's just Verin's guess.

Verin: "Well, Moiraine has never believed in telling anyone anything they did not need to know" Yep, and often even less.

- The blackthorn bush: Nynaeve's sigil plant ...

- Egwene's dreams change - she gains more access to TAR.

Ch. 13: Rand uses the Power on the portal stone,. but doesn't know what to do with it. He later succeeds because Lanfear tells him how to do it. - This seems to prove that he did not send himself, Loial and Hurin into the parallel world (yes, one could argue that he did many things just by need, without knowing how), that it was Lanfear's doing.

- For the first time, Rand is pushed into a leadership role, and does well in it.

Ch. 14: Perrin ("strong sense of duty", Eg will say later) does what he least likes to do.

- From Verin, we learn a nice new expression for all the surprising turns in the story: "How .... providential."

 

[Toral Delvar]

Re: 2015 Re-Readalong: TGH Chapters 10-16

The strange repeating may have something to do with Fain, as he does something similar after killing the two Asha'man in Far Madding

 

[Kassina Tendar]

Re: 2015 Re-Readalong: TGH Chapters 10-16

General thoughts:

Also how small are the nations in Randland, they get across Malkier really darn fast for something that is supposed to be a nation unto itself.

I just figured that they only mentioned it when they could see the towers and lakes, but that Malkier itself was much bigger than that. That was just the one bit that hadn't gotten completely swallowed by the Blight.

-I really like Perrin early on before Faile comes in. Seriously, I'd forgotten how cool he is early on. I think Faile and how frustrated I got with the 'will he, won't he?' on the woolfbrother/axe thing overshadowed that in later books for me. I cheered inside when he said "Shut up, Mat" when Mat was giving Rand a hard time.

Chapter 10:
Referring to Ingtar:

he stared down the trail they followed as if his hope of the Light lay at the end of it.

Really not sure what was up with the flies and the weird trap there in the house in the village. I guess it must have been Lanfear, but it's still weird...

Chapter 11:

Perrin and Mat FINALLY get it. And what does Mat do? Run away. This part of his personality makes me so mad. He's got a flippin' cursed dagger that can kill with a single scratch and is making HIM crazy, and he still treats Rand that way? And later on when he has all those memories, it doesn't get any better. Generally I love Mat, but this makes me so mad!

Yeah! I had the same thought in that scene. :rolleyes

What was Rand's 'vanishing trick' that Fain referred to? My guess was that it had something to do with Aes Sedai being around? Or did he go somewhere regularly that would mask Fain from seeing him?

Chapter 12:

If you really can Dream, it may be that you can Foretell, as well. That would be a finger in the Reds' eye.

Why would that bother the Reds in particular if Egwene's can Fortell? :scratch

Chapter 15:
What are the burned swatches in the portal stone world?

Chapter 16:

The Royal Library in Cairhien is one o the greatest in the world, perhaps the greatest outside Tar Valon. The Aiel spared it deliberately, you know, when they burned Cairhien. They will not destroy a book.

That makes me like the Aiel even more. (you know, except for the whole mass murder thing )

Egwene dreamed about Lanfear bending over Rand while he slept beneath the stone. Do you think Rand actually used the stone in his sleep or maybe Lanfear did it?

 

[Megana Vallentin]

Re: 2015 Re-Readalong: TGH Chapters 10-16

What was Rand's 'vanishing trick' that Fain referred to? My guess was that it had something to do with Aes Sedai being around? Or did he go somewhere regularly that would mask Fain from seeing him?

Good question...I had assumed it was whenever he was "in the void", but now that you point it out I don't know why I would assume it to be that. :scratch