S1E7 “The Dark Along the Ways” —w/Book Spoilers

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Ty al'Djinn

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Keisha al'Benn

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That doesn’t make it better for me.

You can address all that in other ways, but when Rafe plunks down “you proposed to Laila the day Egwene and I got together” he’s getting nothing but eye rolling from me.
It doesn't for me either....it's just another thing that I'm trying to swallow because it might make "better cinematic sense." If they hadn't thrown in Laila in the first place we could focus on the actual story instead of trying to constantly make up new stuff because 'oh yeah, Perrin had a wife and we can't let the audience forget that.'
 
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Something else I kept meaning to brag on about this episode is how well-written Egwene's speech was to the EF5 in their rooms (before the love triangle reared its head). Listening to it I began to realize how well she was organizing her thoughts and persuading the others and I was like, "Wow, yes this is a woman who can be a leader!"
 

Lyndo Shiranui

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After this episode, I can see that they did a mistake with that fifth episode. I liked the fifth episode but it was so unnecessary, I can see that now. They could add more to the world and character development with episodes like this(7th). Well, except the silly love triangle thingy. That was like Alfrid character in the Hobbit series. It was unnecessary, it didn't add anything and it was a middle finger to our hopes for a good series. But like Keisha Sedai said, I'll try to swallow that scene with trying to find any logical explanation.

Back to criticizing the fifth episode; if the series had like 10-12 episodes in one season, then yeah, go for that 'Kerene's Warder commits suicide', but you have only 8 episodes to tell your story and build up your characters and make us care for them. And we surely didn't have any time for that because they rushed the first episode so much. We could watch trolllocs' attack in Emond's Field in the second episode, which would be much more impactful because we could start liking the characters and the village before the attack.

Back to seventh episode again; Other thing I didn't like was Agelmar. If you want to give a social justice message by creating a character that doesn't want any help from women simply because they are women, then please ruin another character instead of Agelmar, like Masema. If they did Masema's character like this, we would have a reason to hate him from the start, we were going to hate him later anyway. But I am sad that I have to hate Agelmar now.

Other than love triangle and Agelmar, it was a nice episode, not as good as the fourth episode (it was a masterpiece), but still good.
 

Alora Sionn

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If it helps Lyndo, I didn't see it as Agelmar not wanting help from women just because they're women, I saw it as he is a prideful Lord of an area constantly at war with the Blight, and feeling like Borderlanders fight their own battles. His sister having trained at the Tower possibly constantly advises him to get help from the Aes Sedai which makes him feel like she thinks him and their people can't do what they've always done which is hold back the shadow, and so seeing Moiraine is just the last straw and since he's heard enough of it from his sister he kinda gets snippy with her assuming she went behind his back requesting aid from the Tower.

That's the way I saw that, and I don't hate him it's a very human thing to do lol
 

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If it helps Lyndo, I didn't see it as Agelmar not wanting help from women just because they're women, I saw it as he is a prideful Lord of an area constantly at war with the Blight, and feeling like Borderlanders fight their own battles.
I entirely agree, but I wish they hadn't changed the character so much. I didn't see it as a misogynistic thing.
 

Lyndo Shiranui

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If it helps Lyndo, I didn't see it as Agelmar not wanting help from women just because they're women, I saw it as he is a prideful Lord of an area constantly at war with the Blight, and feeling like Borderlanders fight their own battles. His sister having trained at the Tower possibly constantly advises him to get help from the Aes Sedai which makes him feel like she thinks him and their people can't do what they've always done which is hold back the shadow, and so seeing Moiraine is just the last straw and since he's heard enough of it from his sister he kinda gets snippy with her assuming she went behind his back requesting aid from the Tower.

That's the way I saw that, and I don't hate him it's a very human thing to do lol

I entirely agree, but I wish they hadn't changed the character so much. I didn't see it as a misogynistic thing.

I checked it now and the subtitle was wrong, yeah. When Moiraine and Agelmar's sister were talking, Moiraine says something like ''Why would he feel a need to ask her(referring to Min) when he knows all the answers.'' But the subtitle was like ''Why would he ask a woman when he knows all the answers.'' I didn't think a subtitle in Amazon Prime could be that wrong though.
 
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I have had issues with Spanish- English translations just not being there for other shows. Amazon's subtitle skills aren't rated too highly by me for now
 

Jocasta Braithe

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Subtitles are almost always awful. I definitely read Agelmar as being prickly about accepting advice, because he's doing fine on his own thank you, not so much as just not wanting help from women specifically. I think they were trying to show that sense you get in the books that Aes Sedai meddle with the nations and the nations don't always like it. I think the borderlands were probably the wrong place to show that, because they get along better with Aes Sedai generally than places like Tear, but we're not going to Tear this season, so they did it where they could as part of trying to build the world. I am not prepared to hate Agelmar yet.... he came around once he realized Moiraine wasn't there to try to make him look like a bad leader.
 

Siusane al'Cuyler

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as for the subtitles, I hadn't caught the different words there but I have seen multiple misspellings. they're not perfect, for sure.

I'm guessing episode 5 was building us up for something likely to happen in episode 8.
 

Morgana Arakos

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On the topic of Agelmar, some of non-book reader reactors I watched felt like that scene actually painted him in a good light--it showed that he was willing to put aside his pride, listen to Moiraine's advice, and take action immediately. I'm not sure how it was intended, but rewatching it I felt like it did ultimately paint him as a good leader.

As far as episode 5 goes, I think it's hard for us as book readers to judge whether or not it was unnecessary. I definitely think there are scenes I would have rather seen on the screen if the show was made just for me. But, watching it with my non-book-reader partner, I think that episode did a lot to help him understand the show and get invested in the characters. It really developed the warder/aes sedai relationship, and gave us a deep understanding of the stakes for what would happen to Lan if something happened to Moiraine. It was also a great episode for developing the gender dynamics of the world, and showing that warders have their own culture and personality and aren't just "lap dogs with two legs" (like they kind of are in the books :P).

I feel like this season has, of necessity, been more about world building than about advancing the story. Wheel of Time is such a huge and complex world, and they clearly wanted to introduce people to it in a way that didn't feel overly info dumpy/hand holdy. So, we get a lot of showing and not telling, and because viewers who are new to the world have to absorb all that it means that we also lose some detail from the books. My hope is that, because they've done such a good job of laying the groundwork this season for the big concepts in the world (aside from, perhaps, the details of the prophecy), we'll be able to get more detail next season without having to spend as much time on exposition.
 
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^ 100% this. Well said Morgana.
 
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